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Author Topic: Grading Raiders 2017 draft class after second season  (Read 301 times)

805raiderslo

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Grading Raiders 2017 draft class after second season
« on: January 30, 2019, 08:23:00 PM »

Recently we put out some grades for the Raiders rookie class. There were some who grumbled that you can’t grade players after one season, but that’s simply not true. You can grade them every step of the way to see their progress.

In that spirit, we look back to the previous class to see how they are looking after two seasons.

Round 1, pick 24: Gareon Conley, CB, Ohio State
This past season was basically Conley’s rookie campaign. He was injured most of his rookie season, so there wasn’t much by which to judge him. He began this season still trying to get his footing and after midseason he got it. By season’s end he was arguably the best player on this defense, putting up 8 passes defended and two interceptions over the final six games and if he keeps it up, he could be a cornerstone in the rebuild.

Grade: B+
Round 2, pick 56: Obi Melifonwu, S, UConn

Physical gifts for days. But just couldn’t stay on the field. The little time he did spend on the field, he lacked the pop you need from an enforcing strong safety. Soft, as they like to say. He was placed on IR to begin the season before being cut and signed with the Patriots, appearing in just two games last season.

Grade: F
Round 3, pick 88: Eddie Vanderdoes, DI, UCLA

Started his entire rookie season and was a complete non-factor. He then tore his ACL in the season finale, causing him to miss his entire second season. Gruden has said he would like to get him back, but Gruden also re-signed Justin Ellis and drafted PJ Hall and Maurice Hurst to give the team interior pass rush. It’s hard to say if Vanderdoes will ever be a factor.

Grade: D
Round 4, pick 129: David Sharpe, OT, Florida

Started a couple games at the end of 2017 at left tackle. One good game, one terrible one. Last training camp, he even looked like he might compete at one of the tackle spots. Then he was waived in the final roster cuts, signed to the Texans’ practice squad, waived by them, and claimed by the Raiders as injury insurance. Depending on what the team does at tackle in the offseason, Sharpe could be back in the mix possibly at right tackle, but it’s just as likely he won’t make the roster again.

Grade: D
Round 5, pick 168: Marquel Lee, LB, Wake Forest

The last coaching staff had high hopes for him as a rookie, even giving him the starting middle linebacker job for a short time. That didn’t work out because he was a liability in coverage. Lee showed great strides in his second season and was again given the chance to be the team’s middle linebacker. Ultimately, he would play sparingly — mainly in short yardage situations — sharing time with undrafted rookie Jason Cabinda. And middle linebacker is still a glaring need area.

Grade: C+
Round 7, pick 221: Shalom Luani, S, Washington State

The ‘Football playin’ Jesse’ looked fantastic in his first offseason, but didn’t see much time in the regular season. When he did play on defense, he showed he had some holes in his game. He was traded before the season for a 7th round pick. So, the Raiders got back what they spent to get him. Like scratching off a lottery ticket and winning another ticket.

Grade: C
Round 7, pick 231: Jylan Ware, OT, Alabama State

Was always a flier and he was always out of his depth against NFL talent.

Grade: F
Round 7, pick 242: Elijah Hood, RB, North Carolina

For as excited as he was to join the backfield with Marshawn Lynch, he never got that chance. He hasn’t played an NFL snap.

Grade: F
Round 7, pick 244: Treyvon Hester, DI, Toledo

Hester looked quite good, well outperforming draft counterpart Vanderdoes despite receiving far few snaps. For some reason the Raiders waived him prior to the season even with Vanderdoes out for the season and Justin Ellis on partial season IR. He signed on with the Eagles and played in 12 games. Can’t speak on the decision to let him go, but he was certainly a solid pick this low in the draft.

Grade: A
Overall grade: D+

This class offered nothing in their rookie season. Outside of Gareon Conley, what else did they have to show for it last season? Only four of the nine players are even still on the team. Does Conley’s selection make up for what could be missing on basically the other eight picks? If he can play in his third season the way he did in the second half of last season, it would at least bring this class to a passing grade. Some contributions from any of the three others still on the roster.

https://www.silverandblackpride.com/2019/1/30/18204374/grading-raiders-2017-draft-class-after-second-season
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nutmg1

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Re: Grading Raiders 2017 draft class after second season
« Reply #1 on: January 31, 2019, 11:01:43 AM »

Wow good thing Conley fell to us.
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CB

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Re: Grading Raiders 2017 draft class after second season
« Reply #2 on: February 01, 2019, 12:23:40 AM »

We can't have anything close to this over the next 2-3 drafts. We gotta hit on half of better of our picks.
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ghostmech

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Re: Grading Raiders 2017 draft class after second season
« Reply #3 on: February 01, 2019, 10:15:01 AM »

Wow   :o  An overall Grade of D+...  and Jon Gruden had nothing to do with it.  ;)
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varaider

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Re: Grading Raiders 2017 draft class after second season
« Reply #4 on: February 02, 2019, 01:07:43 AM »

Let's see...

Conley was a brilliant pick, after we (RM) did his homework and EVERYONE HERE DOUBTED him and shit on the pick... Except yours truly...

Obi was sent packing by Gruden... and has wowed the likes of Belichick, who've kept him on the roster all season...

Vanderdoes was INJURED...

Sharpe was cut, by Gruden, for the likes of Breno Giacomini (who the FUCK?)... and then was brought BACK... after he realized he fucked up and Breno was what he always was, a BUM... And it was Gruden's decision to move a Perennial Pro Bowl LT ro RT and got him injured, leaving us to start a rookie from a NC A&T...

Marquel Lee was one of the best LB we had, outside of Morrow (ALSO brought in as a UDFA this same year)... Both of them ended up being the best LBs on the team... for 2 straight years...

This is where it gets funny, because they actually GRADED 7th round fucking picks, lmao...

But... Hester, drafted in the SEVENTH round, turned out to be pretty damn good for US... AND the Eagles, go figure... He was sent packing by who?  Gruden... For bums like Carradine, McDonald, Hankins, etc... WTF...

People put to much WHATEVER on who was drafted in what round, and yadda yadda yadda... A baller in the 6th or 7th round, is no different than a baller in the 1st or 2nd round... Only difference is the salary... Ask Antonio Brown, or Tom Brady, etc...

Not to mention, most here always wave the banner... "You can't really grade a draft for a few years"... But are smitten by this evaluation, a year later...

This draft could easily be labeled a D+ simply because Gruden (or whoever you want to blame) shipped half the draft away... and the ones who WERE shipped away, seem to be loved by their current teams...  This, IMO, wasn't a grade on the actual players/talent... it was a grade on how that draft benefited the Raiders... So when you ship half the fucking draft away... WHAT DO YOU EXPECT???

The grade would be BETTER, if we actually KEPT the players and DEVELOPED them, like a REAL  >GOOD< Coaching staff would have and could have done...
« Last Edit: February 02, 2019, 01:10:11 AM by varaider »
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805raiderslo

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Re: Grading Raiders 2017 draft class after second season
« Reply #5 on: February 02, 2019, 01:09:37 AM »

Let's see...

Conley was a brilliant pick, after we (RM) did his homework and EVERYONE HERE DOUBTED him and shit on the pick... Except yours truly...

Obi was sent packing by Gruden... and has wowed the likes of Belichick, who've kept him on the roster all season...

Vanderdoes was INJURED...

Sharpe was cut, by Gruden, for the likes of Breno Giacomini (who the FUCK?)... and then was brought BACK... after he realized he fucked up and Breno was what he always was, a BUM... And it was Gruden's decision to move a Perennial Pro Bowl LT ro RT and got him injured, leaving us to start a rookie from a NC A&T...

Marquel Lee was one of the best LB we had, outside of Morrow (ALSO brought in as a UDFA this same year)... Both of them ended up being the best LBs on the team... for 2 straight years...

This is where it gets funny, because they actually GRADED 7th round fucking picks, lmao...

But... Hester, drafted in the SEVENTH round, turned out to be pretty damn good for US... AND the Eagles, go figure... He was sent packing by who?  Gruden... For bums like Carradine, McDonald, Hankins, etc... WTF...

People put to much WHATEVER on who was drafted in what round, and yadda yadda yadda... A baller in the 6th or 7th round, is no different than a baller in the 1st or 2nd round... Only difference is the salary... Ask Antonio Brown, or Tom Brady, etc...

Not to mention, most here always wave the banner... "You can't really grade a draft for a few years"... But are smitten by this evaluation, a year later...

This draft could easily be labeled a D+ simply because Gruden (or whoever you want to blame) shipped half the draft away... and the ones who WERE shipped away, seem to be loved by their current teams...  This, IMO, wasn't a grade on the actual players/talent... it was a grade on how that draft benefited the Raiders... So when you ship half the fucking draft away... WHAT DO YOU EXPECT???
Here we go!
Yawn..........
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Earl

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Re: Grading Raiders 2017 draft class after second season
« Reply #6 on: February 02, 2019, 09:16:59 AM »

I'm pretty sure VA just Yadda Yadda'd sex.

I'm also pretty sure the sex was with himself. The self love is clearly evident.

It started with touching. See... "except yours truly"

It got really exciting with the... "Yadda Yadda Yadda".

And he ended with.... "Gruden (or whoever you want to blame)".

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CB

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Re: Grading Raiders 2017 draft class after second season
« Reply #7 on: February 02, 2019, 09:17:28 AM »

Let's see...

Conley was a brilliant pick, after we (RM) did his homework and EVERYONE HERE DOUBTED him and shit on the pick... Except yours truly...

Obi was sent packing by Gruden... and has wowed the likes of Belichick, who've kept him on the roster all season...

Vanderdoes was INJURED...

Sharpe was cut, by Gruden, for the likes of Breno Giacomini (who the FUCK?)... and then was brought BACK... after he realized he fucked up and Breno was what he always was, a BUM... And it was Gruden's decision to move a Perennial Pro Bowl LT ro RT and got him injured, leaving us to start a rookie from a NC A&T...

Marquel Lee was one of the best LB we had, outside of Morrow (ALSO brought in as a UDFA this same year)... Both of them ended up being the best LBs on the team... for 2 straight years...

This is where it gets funny, because they actually GRADED 7th round fucking picks, lmao...

But... Hester, drafted in the SEVENTH round, turned out to be pretty damn good for US... AND the Eagles, go figure... He was sent packing by who?  Gruden... For bums like Carradine, McDonald, Hankins, etc... WTF...

People put to much WHATEVER on who was drafted in what round, and yadda yadda yadda... A baller in the 6th or 7th round, is no different than a baller in the 1st or 2nd round... Only difference is the salary... Ask Antonio Brown, or Tom Brady, etc...

Not to mention, most here always wave the banner... "You can't really grade a draft for a few years"... But are smitten by this evaluation, a year later...

This draft could easily be labeled a D+ simply because Gruden (or whoever you want to blame) shipped half the draft away... and the ones who WERE shipped away, seem to be loved by their current teams...  This, IMO, wasn't a grade on the actual players/talent... it was a grade on how that draft benefited the Raiders... So when you ship half the fucking draft away... WHAT DO YOU EXPECT???

The grade would be BETTER, if we actually KEPT the players and DEVELOPED them, like a REAL  >GOOD< Coaching staff would have and could have done...

Two questions. Are you satisfied with this draft? Can you honestly say this is the quality you want from your picks every season?

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varaider

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Re: Grading Raiders 2017 draft class after second season
« Reply #8 on: February 02, 2019, 11:02:26 AM »

I'm pretty sure VA just Yadda Yadda'd sex.

I'm also pretty sure the sex was with himself. The self love is clearly evident.

It started with touching. See... "except yours truly"

It got really exciting with the... "Yadda Yadda Yadda".

And he ended with.... "Gruden (or whoever you want to blame)".

And you, as usual, made a complete post about "yours truly"...

And nothing relevant to the topic...

You wanna suck my dick don't ya?

Sorry bud, it don't swing that way...
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varaider

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Re: Grading Raiders 2017 draft class after second season
« Reply #9 on: February 02, 2019, 11:29:01 AM »

Let's see...

Conley was a brilliant pick, after we (RM) did his homework and EVERYONE HERE DOUBTED him and shit on the pick... Except yours truly...

Obi was sent packing by Gruden... and has wowed the likes of Belichick, who've kept him on the roster all season...

Vanderdoes was INJURED...

Sharpe was cut, by Gruden, for the likes of Breno Giacomini (who the FUCK?)... and then was brought BACK... after he realized he fucked up and Breno was what he always was, a BUM... And it was Gruden's decision to move a Perennial Pro Bowl LT ro RT and got him injured, leaving us to start a rookie from a NC A&T...

Marquel Lee was one of the best LB we had, outside of Morrow (ALSO brought in as a UDFA this same year)... Both of them ended up being the best LBs on the team... for 2 straight years...

This is where it gets funny, because they actually GRADED 7th round fucking picks, lmao...

But... Hester, drafted in the SEVENTH round, turned out to be pretty damn good for US... AND the Eagles, go figure... He was sent packing by who?  Gruden... For bums like Carradine, McDonald, Hankins, etc... WTF...

People put to much WHATEVER on who was drafted in what round, and yadda yadda yadda... A baller in the 6th or 7th round, is no different than a baller in the 1st or 2nd round... Only difference is the salary... Ask Antonio Brown, or Tom Brady, etc...

Not to mention, most here always wave the banner... "You can't really grade a draft for a few years"... But are smitten by this evaluation, a year later...

This draft could easily be labeled a D+ simply because Gruden (or whoever you want to blame) shipped half the draft away... and the ones who WERE shipped away, seem to be loved by their current teams...  This, IMO, wasn't a grade on the actual players/talent... it was a grade on how that draft benefited the Raiders... So when you ship half the fucking draft away... WHAT DO YOU EXPECT???

The grade would be BETTER, if we actually KEPT the players and DEVELOPED them, like a REAL  >GOOD< Coaching staff would have and could have done...

Two questions. Are you satisfied with this draft? Can you honestly say this is the quality you want from your picks every season?

Let's see...

I would have gladly kept Obi over BUM ASS Nelson or Harris...

I would have glady kept Hester over McDonald, Hankins, Rucker or Carradine...

Vanderdoes was decent, but INJURED all last year, how do you grade that?

Its the

2
0
1
7

draft for crying out loud...

C'mon CB, you're one of the main guys around here that says drafts need a few years to be graded...

This one has a shitty grade, because half the draft was sent packing...

Mind you... ALL of these players are STILL on teams in this league... So, IMO, the jury is still out...

Like I said, it's a "D+" because half the draft is no longer here... which is an accurate grade if we're talking about benefit to the Raiders...

I wouldn't call the talent level a D+... Conley is pretty damn good, Vanderdoes was good when he was healthy, Lee is developing quite well... Sharpe is what he is, a backup T, who Gruden waived... and brought back...

As for you 2nd question, I believe Obi, had he stayed, could have started here... So that's 4-5 starters out of this draft... Because you can't leave our Morrow... Hell, even Hatcher had a start...  Develop them (more than just 1 year) and who knows... So I'll take it... Not all drafts can be 100% studs...
« Last Edit: February 02, 2019, 11:33:38 AM by varaider »
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varaider

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Re: Grading Raiders 2017 draft class after second season
« Reply #10 on: February 02, 2019, 11:35:03 AM »

Let's see...

Conley was a brilliant pick, after we (RM) did his homework and EVERYONE HERE DOUBTED him and shit on the pick... Except yours truly...

Obi was sent packing by Gruden... and has wowed the likes of Belichick, who've kept him on the roster all season...

Vanderdoes was INJURED...

Sharpe was cut, by Gruden, for the likes of Breno Giacomini (who the FUCK?)... and then was brought BACK... after he realized he fucked up and Breno was what he always was, a BUM... And it was Gruden's decision to move a Perennial Pro Bowl LT ro RT and got him injured, leaving us to start a rookie from a NC A&T...

Marquel Lee was one of the best LB we had, outside of Morrow (ALSO brought in as a UDFA this same year)... Both of them ended up being the best LBs on the team... for 2 straight years...

This is where it gets funny, because they actually GRADED 7th round fucking picks, lmao...

But... Hester, drafted in the SEVENTH round, turned out to be pretty damn good for US... AND the Eagles, go figure... He was sent packing by who?  Gruden... For bums like Carradine, McDonald, Hankins, etc... WTF...

People put to much WHATEVER on who was drafted in what round, and yadda yadda yadda... A baller in the 6th or 7th round, is no different than a baller in the 1st or 2nd round... Only difference is the salary... Ask Antonio Brown, or Tom Brady, etc...

Not to mention, most here always wave the banner... "You can't really grade a draft for a few years"... But are smitten by this evaluation, a year later...

This draft could easily be labeled a D+ simply because Gruden (or whoever you want to blame) shipped half the draft away... and the ones who WERE shipped away, seem to be loved by their current teams...  This, IMO, wasn't a grade on the actual players/talent... it was a grade on how that draft benefited the Raiders... So when you ship half the fucking draft away... WHAT DO YOU EXPECT???
Here we go!
Yawn..........

Debate it...

If you disagree...

Yawning is for pussies...

*shrugs*

You and "Earl" must be buddies...   LMAO...
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CB

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Re: Grading Raiders 2017 draft class after second season
« Reply #11 on: February 03, 2019, 10:54:06 AM »

Let's see...

Conley was a brilliant pick, after we (RM) did his homework and EVERYONE HERE DOUBTED him and shit on the pick... Except yours truly...

Obi was sent packing by Gruden... and has wowed the likes of Belichick, who've kept him on the roster all season...

Vanderdoes was INJURED...

Sharpe was cut, by Gruden, for the likes of Breno Giacomini (who the FUCK?)... and then was brought BACK... after he realized he fucked up and Breno was what he always was, a BUM... And it was Gruden's decision to move a Perennial Pro Bowl LT ro RT and got him injured, leaving us to start a rookie from a NC A&T...

Marquel Lee was one of the best LB we had, outside of Morrow (ALSO brought in as a UDFA this same year)... Both of them ended up being the best LBs on the team... for 2 straight years...

This is where it gets funny, because they actually GRADED 7th round fucking picks, lmao...

But... Hester, drafted in the SEVENTH round, turned out to be pretty damn good for US... AND the Eagles, go figure... He was sent packing by who?  Gruden... For bums like Carradine, McDonald, Hankins, etc... WTF...

People put to much WHATEVER on who was drafted in what round, and yadda yadda yadda... A baller in the 6th or 7th round, is no different than a baller in the 1st or 2nd round... Only difference is the salary... Ask Antonio Brown, or Tom Brady, etc...

Not to mention, most here always wave the banner... "You can't really grade a draft for a few years"... But are smitten by this evaluation, a year later...

This draft could easily be labeled a D+ simply because Gruden (or whoever you want to blame) shipped half the draft away... and the ones who WERE shipped away, seem to be loved by their current teams...  This, IMO, wasn't a grade on the actual players/talent... it was a grade on how that draft benefited the Raiders... So when you ship half the fucking draft away... WHAT DO YOU EXPECT???

The grade would be BETTER, if we actually KEPT the players and DEVELOPED them, like a REAL  >GOOD< Coaching staff would have and could have done...

Two questions. Are you satisfied with this draft? Can you honestly say this is the quality you want from your picks every season?

Let's see...

I would have gladly kept Obi over BUM ASS Nelson or Harris...

I would have glady kept Hester over McDonald, Hankins, Rucker or Carradine...

Vanderdoes was decent, but INJURED all last year, how do you grade that?

Its the

2
0
1
7

draft for crying out loud...

C'mon CB, you're one of the main guys around here that says drafts need a few years to be graded...

This one has a shitty grade, because half the draft was sent packing...

Mind you... ALL of these players are STILL on teams in this league... So, IMO, the jury is still out...

Like I said, it's a "D+" because half the draft is no longer here... which is an accurate grade if we're talking about benefit to the Raiders...

I wouldn't call the talent level a D+... Conley is pretty damn good, Vanderdoes was good when he was healthy, Lee is developing quite well... Sharpe is what he is, a backup T, who Gruden waived... and brought back...

As for you 2nd question, I believe Obi, had he stayed, could have started here... So that's 4-5 starters out of this draft... Because you can't leave our Morrow... Hell, even Hatcher had a start...  Develop them (more than just 1 year) and who knows... So I'll take it... Not all drafts can be 100% studs...

My point is we need better than this if we are rebuilding. We can't afford to draft 1 stud and 5 or 6 guys who are either cut or injured half the time. And we surely can't draft 5 or 6 defensive players in this draft and then have those spots all be our biggest weaknesses in 2 years.

This isn't about assigning blame, it's about getting better. We need to draft 3 studs with our top picks and a couple of solid starters later on. That is how you rebuild.

Otherwise we are stuck in the vicious cycle of drafting one starter a year and by the time they hit FA, they are either too expensive or they're gone.
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varaider

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Re: Grading Raiders 2017 draft class after second season
« Reply #12 on: February 03, 2019, 10:08:38 PM »

Let's see...

Conley was a brilliant pick, after we (RM) did his homework and EVERYONE HERE DOUBTED him and shit on the pick... Except yours truly...

Obi was sent packing by Gruden... and has wowed the likes of Belichick, who've kept him on the roster all season...

Vanderdoes was INJURED...

Sharpe was cut, by Gruden, for the likes of Breno Giacomini (who the FUCK?)... and then was brought BACK... after he realized he fucked up and Breno was what he always was, a BUM... And it was Gruden's decision to move a Perennial Pro Bowl LT ro RT and got him injured, leaving us to start a rookie from a NC A&T...

Marquel Lee was one of the best LB we had, outside of Morrow (ALSO brought in as a UDFA this same year)... Both of them ended up being the best LBs on the team... for 2 straight years...

This is where it gets funny, because they actually GRADED 7th round fucking picks, lmao...

But... Hester, drafted in the SEVENTH round, turned out to be pretty damn good for US... AND the Eagles, go figure... He was sent packing by who?  Gruden... For bums like Carradine, McDonald, Hankins, etc... WTF...

People put to much WHATEVER on who was drafted in what round, and yadda yadda yadda... A baller in the 6th or 7th round, is no different than a baller in the 1st or 2nd round... Only difference is the salary... Ask Antonio Brown, or Tom Brady, etc...

Not to mention, most here always wave the banner... "You can't really grade a draft for a few years"... But are smitten by this evaluation, a year later...

This draft could easily be labeled a D+ simply because Gruden (or whoever you want to blame) shipped half the draft away... and the ones who WERE shipped away, seem to be loved by their current teams...  This, IMO, wasn't a grade on the actual players/talent... it was a grade on how that draft benefited the Raiders... So when you ship half the fucking draft away... WHAT DO YOU EXPECT???

The grade would be BETTER, if we actually KEPT the players and DEVELOPED them, like a REAL  >GOOD< Coaching staff would have and could have done...

Two questions. Are you satisfied with this draft? Can you honestly say this is the quality you want from your picks every season?

Let's see...

I would have gladly kept Obi over BUM ASS Nelson or Harris...

I would have glady kept Hester over McDonald, Hankins, Rucker or Carradine...

Vanderdoes was decent, but INJURED all last year, how do you grade that?

Its the

2
0
1
7

draft for crying out loud...

C'mon CB, you're one of the main guys around here that says drafts need a few years to be graded...

This one has a shitty grade, because half the draft was sent packing...

Mind you... ALL of these players are STILL on teams in this league... So, IMO, the jury is still out...

Like I said, it's a "D+" because half the draft is no longer here... which is an accurate grade if we're talking about benefit to the Raiders...

I wouldn't call the talent level a D+... Conley is pretty damn good, Vanderdoes was good when he was healthy, Lee is developing quite well... Sharpe is what he is, a backup T, who Gruden waived... and brought back...

As for you 2nd question, I believe Obi, had he stayed, could have started here... So that's 4-5 starters out of this draft... Because you can't leave our Morrow... Hell, even Hatcher had a start...  Develop them (more than just 1 year) and who knows... So I'll take it... Not all drafts can be 100% studs...

My point is we need better than this if we are rebuilding. We can't afford to draft 1 stud and 5 or 6 guys who are either cut or injured half the time. And we surely can't draft 5 or 6 defensive players in this draft and then have those spots all be our biggest weaknesses in 2 years.

This isn't about assigning blame, it's about getting better. We need to draft 3 studs with our top picks and a couple of solid starters later on. That is how you rebuild.

Otherwise we are stuck in the vicious cycle of drafting one starter a year and by the time they hit FA, they are either too expensive or they're gone.

And I agree... But still, no matter what, you have to develop your players...

If you're drafting guys and WILLINGLY cutting them (rebuild or not), instead of developing them... its a bad recipe...

Typically, your 1st rounder is a definite starter, after that, its a crap shoot... although I believe Obi could have supplanted Nelson or Harris... but they gave up on him... Injuries happen...

All I know... It's gonna be pretty damn hard to fuck up 4 picks in the first 40....
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nutmg1

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Re: Grading Raiders 2017 draft class after second season
« Reply #13 on: February 06, 2019, 11:47:49 AM »

Let's see...

Conley was a brilliant pick, after we (RM) did his homework and EVERYONE HERE DOUBTED him and shit on the pick... Except yours truly...

Obi was sent packing by Gruden... and has wowed the likes of Belichick, who've kept him on the roster all season...

Vanderdoes was INJURED...

Sharpe was cut, by Gruden, for the likes of Breno Giacomini (who the FUCK?)... and then was brought BACK... after he realized he fucked up and Breno was what he always was, a BUM... And it was Gruden's decision to move a Perennial Pro Bowl LT ro RT and got him injured, leaving us to start a rookie from a NC A&T...

Marquel Lee was one of the best LB we had, outside of Morrow (ALSO brought in as a UDFA this same year)... Both of them ended up being the best LBs on the team... for 2 straight years...

This is where it gets funny, because they actually GRADED 7th round fucking picks, lmao...

But... Hester, drafted in the SEVENTH round, turned out to be pretty damn good for US... AND the Eagles, go figure... He was sent packing by who?  Gruden... For bums like Carradine, McDonald, Hankins, etc... WTF...

People put to much WHATEVER on who was drafted in what round, and yadda yadda yadda... A baller in the 6th or 7th round, is no different than a baller in the 1st or 2nd round... Only difference is the salary... Ask Antonio Brown, or Tom Brady, etc...

Not to mention, most here always wave the banner... "You can't really grade a draft for a few years"... But are smitten by this evaluation, a year later...

This draft could easily be labeled a D+ simply because Gruden (or whoever you want to blame) shipped half the draft away... and the ones who WERE shipped away, seem to be loved by their current teams...  This, IMO, wasn't a grade on the actual players/talent... it was a grade on how that draft benefited the Raiders... So when you ship half the fucking draft away... WHAT DO YOU EXPECT???

The grade would be BETTER, if we actually KEPT the players and DEVELOPED them, like a REAL  >GOOD< Coaching staff would have and could have done...

Two questions. Are you satisfied with this draft? Can you honestly say this is the quality you want from your picks every season?

Let's see...

I would have gladly kept Obi over BUM ASS Nelson or Harris...

I would have glady kept Hester over McDonald, Hankins, Rucker or Carradine...

Vanderdoes was decent, but INJURED all last year, how do you grade that?

Its the

2
0
1
7

draft for crying out loud...

C'mon CB, you're one of the main guys around here that says drafts need a few years to be graded...

This one has a shitty grade, because half the draft was sent packing...

Mind you... ALL of these players are STILL on teams in this league... So, IMO, the jury is still out...

Like I said, it's a "D+" because half the draft is no longer here... which is an accurate grade if we're talking about benefit to the Raiders...

I wouldn't call the talent level a D+... Conley is pretty damn good, Vanderdoes was good when he was healthy, Lee is developing quite well... Sharpe is what he is, a backup T, who Gruden waived... and brought back...

As for you 2nd question, I believe Obi, had he stayed, could have started here... So that's 4-5 starters out of this draft... Because you can't leave our Morrow... Hell, even Hatcher had a start...  Develop them (more than just 1 year) and who knows... So I'll take it... Not all drafts can be 100% studs...

My point is we need better than this if we are rebuilding. We can't afford to draft 1 stud and 5 or 6 guys who are either cut or injured half the time. And we surely can't draft 5 or 6 defensive players in this draft and then have those spots all be our biggest weaknesses in 2 years.

This isn't about assigning blame, it's about getting better. We need to draft 3 studs with our top picks and a couple of solid starters later on. That is how you rebuild.

Otherwise we are stuck in the vicious cycle of drafting one starter a year and by the time they hit FA, they are either too expensive or they're gone.

And I agree... But still, no matter what, you have to develop your players...
If you're drafting guys and WILLINGLY cutting them (rebuild or not), instead of developing them... its a bad recipe...

Typically, your 1st rounder is a definite starter, after that, its a crap shoot... although I believe Obi could have supplanted Nelson or Harris... but they gave up on him... Injuries happen...

All I know... It's gonna be pretty damn hard to fuck up 4 picks in the first 40....


Exactly VA.  "Your Players" meaning not Grudens. 

Its very common for a new coach to clear the roster if he doesn't like the players.  It really doesn't matter how they do at other places "BTW none of them have shown that we passed on anything special" if they don't fit with the new coach/system. 

The jury is still out on Conley.  Get back to me with how brilliant he is after he starts 16+ games in a season and makes a pro bowl. 

Obi was inactive almost the entire season.  Check out this state line 2 years into the NFL. 

STATS
Regular Season
Career
TOT   SOLO   AST   SACK   FF   FR   YDS   INT   YDS   AVG   TD   LNG   PD   STF   STFYDS   KB
3   3   0   0   0   0   0   0   0   0.0   0   0   0   0   0   0
10   9   1   0   0   0   0   0   0   0.0   0   0   0   0   0   0


Vander plump was injured when we drafted him and got injured again.  After a good game against TN he sucked the rest of his rookie season.


5th through 7th round picks are mostly disposable.  We didn't need to keep Sharp after drafting 2 rookie tackles who were obviously better than him.  We only brought him back because of injuries and the fact he was in camp with us.  Not because we made a mistake letting him go. 


BTW Sharp was cut Sept 1st.  Breno was cut Aug 27th. 

The fact is this wasn't a good draft.  Even if all of these guys were still on the roster playing exactly like they have since they got cut it wouldn't be a good draft.







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varaider

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Re: Grading Raiders 2017 draft class after second season
« Reply #14 on: February 06, 2019, 06:55:02 PM »

Exactly VA.  "Your Players" meaning not Grudens. 

Its very common for a new coach to clear the roster if he doesn't like the players.  It really doesn't matter how they do at other places "BTW none of them have shown that we passed on anything special" if they don't fit with the new coach/system. 

In year 2?  90% of that draft class (for every team) is still developing... If you CUT them BEFORE year 2?  How do you know what you have?  When TC and half ass Preseason games are you ONLY judge...

So you mean to tell me signing guys like Derrick Johnson (retired mid season), DRC (retired mid season), McDonald, Rucker (both over 35), Brent Giacomini, Whitehead, Carradine, etc, etc, etc... All who cost more than 2nd year rookies, was worth it?  When we could have just saved money and developed the talent we had?  I don't agree with that philosophy, "system or not"... What was proven is that Gruden's "system" was shit and led us to a 4-12 season...

What HAPPENED was, Gruden outsmarted himself, by trying to build a "veteran" team, to the likes of his 2000's team... And cut all the young guys... And it backfired in his face... So he" tanked"... and started to look towards the future...

There is no question that he released more talent than he brought in, and made this team worse than a year ago.... FACT.

(Sorry, you knew that was gonna get a Gruden "rant" outta me... hahahaha)

The jury is still out on Conley.  Get back to me with how brilliant he is after he starts 16+ games in a season and makes a pro bowl. 

Maybe YOUR jury is still out... He started 14 games this year, played in 15, and Gruden started him out this year on the BENCH in lieu of bum ass Melvin and Leon Hall (WTF)... And the other start he missed do to concussion protocol....He took over the starting job and commenced to having 3 INTs this year, 15 PBUs and was the 3rd best CB in the league in targeted QB passer rating/completion percentage... So maybe you jury is watching the wrong player brother, lol...

Conley has been lauded all season, by Raider coaches, other teams' coaches and the pundits... and has developed into a true #1 CB... Hence everybody saying we need to draft a CB to pair with him and be set for the foreseeable future...

https://www.silverandblackpride.com/2018/11/17/18099935/silver-mining-11-17-raiders-gareon-conley-flawless-on-3rd-downs-this-season

http://www.espn.com/blog/oakland-raiders/post/_/id/22514/gareon-conley-finally-impressing-and-possibly-answering-raiders-offseason-needs

http://www.espn.com/blog/oakland-raiders/post/_/id/22514/gareon-conley-finally-impressing-and-possibly-answering-raiders-offseason-needs

https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/pro-raiders-gareon-conley-coming-on-as-of-late-putting-up-strong-numbers-in-coverage

https://raiderswire.usatoday.com/2018/12/03/raiders-cb-gareon-conley-has-allowed-just-15-yards-in-last-3-games/

https://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/local/Conleys-Growth-in-2018-has-Raiders-Believing-He-Could-be-a-Star-503902251.html

Obi was inactive almost the entire season.  Check out this state line 2 years into the NFL. 

STATS
Regular Season
Career
TOT   SOLO   AST   SACK   FF   FR   YDS   INT   YDS   AVG   TD   LNG   PD   STF   STFYDS   KB
3   3   0   0   0   0   0   0   0   0.0   0   0   0   0   0   0
10   9   1   0   0   0   0   0   0   0.0   0   0   0   0   0   0

I guess you forgot he had hip surgery and missed half of last year and half of this year... What team have you been watching bro?  (I'm just ribbing ya)... But seriously... lol...

Obi is still an athletic freak, and very talented... Just watch Belichick get the best out of him (Because he's an actual Great Coach, who knows how to develop players)  Unlike JDR who put him at CORNERBACK... and Gruden, who refused to play him for the likes a BUMS like Nelson and Harris...

Vander plump was injured when we drafted him and got injured again.  After a good game against TN he sucked the rest of his rookie season.

Not sure if I can respect your grading scale, especially after claining the jury is still out on Conley... who has done nothing less than shine every game he's played for us, minus literally 1 or 2... and even in those games he played well...

BUT... you certainly used Vanderdoes injury (torn ACL btw) but completely ignored Obi's?

5th through 7th round picks are mostly disposable.  We didn't need to keep Sharp after drafting 2 rookie tackles who were obviously better than him.  We only brought him back because of injuries and the fact he was in camp with us.  Not because we made a mistake letting him go.

I disagree... 3rd - 7th rounders are MOSTLY crap shoots... The talent in the draft SERIOUSLY drops after the 2nd round... We didn't need to keep Sharpe?  But signed Brent Giacomini, Justin Murray, TJ Clemings... Ok...

And THEN brought Sharpe back... ALONG with Denver Kirkland... Hmmm...

BTW Sharp was cut Sept 1st.  Breno was cut Aug 27th. 

Sharpe was brought back (Nov. 1st)...

The fact is this wasn't a good draft.  Even if all of these guys were still on the roster playing exactly like they have since they got cut it wouldn't be a good draft.

You can't say ANY of that with any positive amount of certainty... Because it's impossible...

And you left our Treyvon Hester... who played WELL for us... AND developed into a heavily rotated DL for the Eagles... actually blocked the kick in the playoff win over the Bears...

What about Denico Autry?

How about this... Autry, Hester and Ward had .5 sack less than our ENTIRE team?  But you say they wouldn't have helped?  Hmmmm

I think you expect too much from later round picks, and hold them to some ultra high standard, just to shit on RM... When 100% of NFL teams have similar drafts just about EVERY year...

I listed RM's draft "ratings" last year, that showed he was in the top 5% in the league, in terms of drafting NFL PLAYERS (guys still on rosters, either with the team that drafted them or new teams)...
« Last Edit: February 06, 2019, 07:29:37 PM by varaider »
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